Oh almighty search engine…LIST ME!

@athankonMar 09.2004

I think that this new forum will give significant help to developers. I am not sure though, that successful retrieval of domain names and web site content is guarantied by careful coding and included text guides to bots. MONEY is the key for higher listing. I am quite new to web development (just a few years) and I am now more confused about the whole process than when I started. I can’t figure out why it takes months for a search engine to list the contents of a web site. Is it the vastness of the internet, the huge amount of data that a search engine has to process or is it the complexity of content validation that is performed (if performed)?

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@PeOfEoMar 09.2004 — #DMOZ.org is a big human edited directory. If you get onto dmoz, you will most likely be on google. You should also submit your site to www.alltheweb.com it is another good search engine. In time if you are on dmoz do not be supprised to find your site on aol, msn, and others if your site is search engine friendly.

@Robert_WellockMar 10.2004 — #Yes DMOZ is the best Directory to get listed in by far... Because it is open-source; mainly unbiased and does not give preference to corporate sites or advertisements - well that is according to the DMOZ Editor Guidelines.

@mattoMar 10.2004 — #from my experience the £200 yahoo express inclusion fee is the quickest way to get google(bot) to visit your site. Dmoz, for all it's size, human input, and weighting should be seen as simply a bonus to be listed in (definately worth doing for any additional page rank points it may provide). My experience is from a commerical background so £200 to be listed in 7 days (plus a week or so for google to notice) provides a quicker turnaround than dmoz which can take months.

While alltheweb, msn, etc are great to be listed on, it's googles ability to drive a much higher proportion of traffic than it's markt share dictates to sites that really impresses me.

Cheers

@mattoMar 10.2004 — #Hi Gus,

ok, thought it was just the web results yahoo had dropped from google, didn't realise there had been a complete cut-off.

So is dmoz the only directory that google looks at now?

Matto

@DaveSWMar 10.2004 — #If you want google to pick up your site then just post a few links to it here - clickable ones for preference.

@mattoMar 10.2004 — #cheers dave - have just figured out how to do that (i think.....).

can you chaps recommend any other discussion forums that are worth registering with to get a feel for whats going on in the search engine marketing world? (not that i'd wish to use them instead of this one - just furthering the grey matter!)

@DaveSWMar 10.2004 — #offhand I think

www.searchenginewatch.com is everything a guy needs...

@DaveSWMar 10.2004 — #ok they don't seem to have a forum there... just loads of info.

you could try http://www.jimworld.com/apps/webmaster.forums/

http://www.searchengine-optimization.nu/phpBB/

@PeOfEoMar 11.2004 — #[i]Originally posted by Robert Wellock [/i]

[B]Yes DMOZ is the best Directory to get listed in by far... Because it is open-source; mainly unbiased and does not give preference to corporate sites or advertisements - well that is according to the DMOZ Editor Guidelines. [/B][/QUOTE] I am editor a games --> clans / guilds ? The descript needs to be accurate, we edit them if they are not, make them accurate. If the site has very little content or is under contstruction and full of 404s it just sits in the pile of unlisted... waiting. We also move sites around a lot to get them into a proper categoy. I do the clans but we get clans that play shooter games and we can find a better categor for that... clans --> shooter, and if they play one game we can put them in that games clan category. So it really is pretty darned organized.

@stargal98Mar 18.2004 — #I refuse to pay for SEO. And I'll tell you why: I code my pages, check for (free) site optimization through Sitescreamer.com and keep up on the newest developments...I taught myself SEO and now I know what I'm doing. In the year since I've been doing this stuff, the companies I SEO, code and design for enjoy top placement. Some are on the top page of Google, others are within the first 4 pages. Yahoo, I'm loving their algorithm because I'm top page on every single search topic.

Now, one or two of the companies are thinking about paying for placement, and while I'll let them, I challenge you to learn which meta tags work for you pages. Do the research and devote just a little time yourself, and you'll be surprised just how well you do. My philosophy is not to give another company power over a site you control if you can help it.

Why do sites take so long to index? It's because there are BILLIONS of sites out there. Just make sure you have a decent set of meta tags, pick your words carefully and keep learning.

Personally, I will not look at Ad-Words or paid listings, because I think that they had to pay to get those good rankings, and that I would not be interested in that.

Hope this helps!

@cohwillMar 19.2004 — #Let me clear up a few things here.

Yahoo has a brand new search engine that uses Inktomi and Overture results. They have dropped Google completely.

You can no longer submit to Inktomi or AlltheWeb, as Yahoo has dumped them into a new program at Overture called Site Match that fuses paid inclusion and pay per click together (so you have to pay twice).

The rumor is that AlltheWeb and AltaVista will soon disappear, eaten by Yahoo.

Google uses a lot of smaller directories and search engines, including DMOZ. DMOZ is not doing too well right now because the volunteer editors are getting too far behind. It also seems to be having server problems.

Google is still free, except for the AdWords and AdSense advertising campaigns.

The key to good positioning on the search engines is having excellent meta tags and keywords in your content. And, submitting your site to ALL relevant search engines and directories. They description and keywords tags do not have to be on every page, unless you are selling products.

I disagree with Stargal in that why bother learning SEO when there are people like myself who do nothing but SEO all day long? You web developers and designers (and business owners) have enough to do without having to learn a whole new field.

@stargal98Mar 19.2004 — #I disagree with Stargal in that why bother learning SEO when there are people like myself who do nothing but SEO all day long? You web developers and designers (and business owners) have enough to do without having to learn a whole new field. [/QUOTE]

I think it's important to know about your site. And if you have the time, I encourage it because all of the information out there is just waiting for you. I know that I like to be in control of my site, and if there are changes made by an independent firm (like seo firms), I want to be able to see what changes were made and understand them. Obviously not every one feels this way, and that is okay. Whatever gets the job done, but just know that there ARE options for you if you do not want to spend a lot of money.

@Vix332Mar 21.2004 — #Hi stargal98,

I am all for learning SEO myself send me to right place please?

I looked at the site you mentioned but could find nothing free?

I am frustrated by lack of or just plain misinformation in this field - I have all but given up and decided to go with dedicated SEO companies but really don't think it should be necessary - I am no dummy I reckon I can learn it!

any help gratefully received

Vix?

@cohwillMar 21.2004 — #The best place to start is http://www.searchenginewatch.com . There are a lot of free articles here, also under Search Day in the Navigation bar.

Other places to look:

http://www.jimworld.com/apps/webmaster.forums (this is where I began)

http://www.cre8asite.net

http://www.searchengineworld.com

http://www.highrankings.com (even has a great newsletter)

http://www.searchengineguide.com

@fifstaMar 29.2004 — #I agree with Anita

We never had to pay for high rankings on Search Engines, and our sites are all fairly high ranked. The secret is a good amount content, where keywords, descriptions and alt tags are relevant to the content. Also stick by the rules, and the Seacrch Engines will notice your sites above others. Another good pointer is to keep your code clean, and name your html page as close as possible to the Heading.

Thats it ?

@bizabilityApr 03.2004 — #To optimize for Google, the leading SE:

*lots of relevant textual content

*minimize/contain graphics, which spiders see as empty pages

*maximize human readable text

*internal links

*site map link on every page

*keyword density

*W3C HTML 4.01 code compliance

*few or no redundant links

*avoid Flash, ShockWave, PDF, any non-HTML

*static sites better than dynamic

*links go to relevant information, not just product lists

*avoid long query strings, use simple URLs

*avoid session ID strings, spiders don't like to identify

*avoid mirror sites, multiple domain names

*maintain dedicated content per page

*avoid login to view site

*avoid re-directs

*eliminate broken links, link rot

*avoid cold fusion

*lead with info, go deep with info

*add more content pages

*lead with keywords, not company name or product names

*include relevant content on Contact Us page, not just contact info

*check site functionality every 72 hours

*avoid automatic submission services

*get into dmoz

*maintain fast download of site

*put 800 number, fax, email, land address, in headers and footers of ALL pages

*abstain from cloaking

*use server alias to point other domains to your one site

@roadsterdriverApr 03.2004 — #Biz,

Nice. Clear. Consice.

Thank you.

@lindamoranApr 22.2004 — #Does anybody know how best to nudge DMOZ along? I've been waiting since December. How long can it take to get into DMOZ? Thanks. Linda

[URL=http://www.lindamoran.net]lindamoran.net[/URL]

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